Article 1101 of alt.fan.john-palmer: From: dewey@risc.sps.mot.com (Dewey Henize) Newsgroups: biz.comp.services,alt.internet.services,alt.fan.john-palmer Subject: Re: Mustard Seed Internet Gateway - Free 1 week trial Date: 19 Jan 1994 18:41:30 -0600 Organization: Motorola, Austin Tx NNTP-Posting-Host: rtfm.sps.mot.com Ray C Schuler/040863/burlingt/B00003d wrote: >In article , chip@fin.uucp (Chip Salzenberg) writes: >|> Mustard Seed is also a John Palmer front. Avoid it, too. >|> -- >|> Chip Salzenberg or > >-- > >---------------------------------------- >Would you explain what a "John Palmer front" is and why it should >be avoided? > > Regards, > Ray Schuler There's an FAQ rumored to exist, but... John Palmer is the only person who's postings(*) have been so scummy, slimy, dishonest, and selfcontradictory that he's been refused permission to even post to comp.newprod. Over the years, posts from John Palmer have appeared with threats of lawsuits over newgroups/rmgroups, warnings about the huge pistol he has available at all times, and a whole assortment of business enterprises that seem to be oriented around the least honest offering for the fastest dollar. His major jump to fame occurred after his offering of full and complete newsfeeds for a fee, from a site where he had specifically and clearly noted that he was prescreening individual posters who had upset him or called his bluff about his varying blusterings and threats. (*) Additionally, every time JP has been caught in some apparent lie, there are immediate postings explaining how the earlier postings were forgeries by the dark and dangerous folks who are out to get him. If that doesn't work (never has), additional personas are trotted out who happen to use the language exactly like John, who spell exactly like John, who post from John's machine...etc. who explain that once again John has left/been fired/whatever and they are really the owners of the most current business. They are soon proven to not exist and the cycle restarts. Level 1 of usenet pride is if JP calls you an 'asshole'. Level 2 of usenet pride is when he promises to sic his virtual lawyers on you for hurting his pride with truth. Regards, Dew -- Dewey Henize Sys/Net admin RISC hardware (512) 891-8637 pager 928-7333 x 8637 Article 1706 of alt.fan.john-palmer: Newsgroups: alt.fan.john-palmer From: as678@yfn.ysu.edu (Ron Bauerle) Subject: Latest Palmer Papers list Sender: usenet@crdnns.crd.ge.com (USENET News System) Nntp-Posting-Host: csp189.erie.ge.com Reply-To: as678@yfn.ysu.edu Organization: Youngstown Freenet Date: Fri, 5 Aug 1994 22:46:38 GMT Time for the latest info from Michigan... All of the following information is publicly available from the following sources: 1. The Michigan Dept. of Commerce Records Information and Certification Unit in Lansing, MI (1-900-555-0031 ($1.50/min)). Copies of the records are $1/page, $6/minimum per company. 2. Various business directories 3. The Phone-Disc CD Rom or actual phone books. The following is a chronological history of JPP corporations, as best as I could piece it together: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- The Thundercat Group Inc., Corporate ID 399-422. Incorporated 6/22/87 by John P. Palmer II, one share, valued at $1000. Purpose: "To engage in the business of software design, operating computer systems for the purpose of selling computer time and to provide computer consulting services." Assumed name The Thundercat Software Co., filed 3/17/88 Annual report filed 5/15/88 Assumed name Cair Paravel Co., filed 6/13/88 Assumed name Lompoc Consulting Co., filed 6/13/88 Assumed name Thundercat Systems, Inc., filed 1/24/89 Annual report filed 5/15/89 This company was apparently automatically dissolved 5/15/92, and all of the above assumed names expired on that date also. Comment: this appears to explain somebody else's post that tygra was a character on the Thundercats show. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Detroit Direct Marketing, Inc., Corporate ID 390-050 Incorporated 5/30/90 by John P. Palmer II, one share. Purpose: (not a direct quote) - to engage in direct marketing in the Detroit area. Assumed name Michigan Network Systems, Inc. filed ??? Annual report filed 5/15/93 Automatic dissolution filed 5/15/93 1991 file closed (annual rpt. incomplete) filed 2/ 1/94 The 1993 annual report showed the following: Total assets (notes & accounts receivable): $ 476.96 Liabilities & equity: Notes & accounts payable, trade: 109,791.83 Stockholders equity, common stock: 500.00 Retained earnings (deficit) (109,814.87) Total stockholders equity (109,314.87) Total liabilities & equity 476.96 This company was apparently automatically dissolved 5/15/93, and the assumed name expired on that date. However the Detroit Business Directory shows the following for 4626 Bedford: Michigan Network Systems, a new listing, 881-8568. Also, the 93/94 East area (Detroit) Yellow Pages show the following under Computer Timesharing Services: Detroit Direct Marketing, Inc., 34486 Gratiot, Clinton Township, 790-6426. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- The Rabbit Network, Inc., Corporate ID 327-774 Incorporated 10/10/91 by John P. Palmer II Purpose: "To operate a high-speed computer network" One authorized common share. Address and mailing address of registered office: 34486 Gratiot Suite 200, Clinton Twp, Michigan, 48043 Name of resident agent: John P. Palmer II Name and address of incorporator: John P. Palmer II 4626 Bedford Detroit, MI 48824 (Note: NOT "Trevor M. Keyes III" of Farmington, MI as faxed to Karl Denninger by "J. Havel" and posted to a.f.jp and news.admin.misc by Karl on 11/8/93. I found no listing for "Trevor Keyes" in the Farmington phone book or on Phone Disc, although there is a John W. Havel in Sterling Heights, MI. It would be interesting to compare the papers received by Karl with the actual ones filed in Michigan and see the differences.) Signed by John P. Palmer II The last page repeats the Bedford address for where to return the document. It also gives a phone number but I won't publicize it (for now). I have copies of these Rabbit Net incorporation papers; I will send a copy of all 4 pages to anybody who sends me a long SASE and either $1 cash or 3 29-cent stamps - get your very own copy of JPP's signature!!! Amaze your friends!!! Other history: Code 84: Annual report, billed for penalty, H; P$20, 5/15/92 Code 82: Annual report, report returned, RN/text letter, 5/15/93 Comment letter 347-Mar, Correction notice, MLK examiner, prepared 6/ 7/93 Form 541, cert. of assumed name Macombnet, Inc., 7/11/94 status: pending, comeback 7/21/94, reject: 45 71 Code 24: Sec. 922, automatic dissolution or revocation 7/15/94 Form 520, cert. of change of reg. office, res. agent 7/21/94 Form 2500, profit annual report, examiner ML, status: held 7/22/94 They didn't have copies of the above in the system, and I didn't try to see the originals (but they did confirm that no annual reports were on file). That pending assumed name of Macombnet and change of registered office and resident agent look interesting; unfortunately I won't be able to get an update until December. Still, if posts from Macombnet start showing up... The Macomb Co. Business Directory shows the following for 34486 Gratiot: The Rabbit Network, a new listing, 790-0094. Also, the 93/94 East area (Detroit) Yellow Pages show the following under Computers - Software & Services: The Rabbit Network, 34486 Gratiot, Clinton Township, 790-0094. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- The Mustard Seed Inc., Corporate ID 480-705 Incorporated 1/26/93 by John P. Palmer (what happened to the "II"?) Purpose: "Property acquisition, development and management" 500 shares; term: perpetual. Address and mailing address of registered office: 4626 Bedbord, Detroit, MI 48224-3625 Name of resident agent: John P. Palmer Name and address of incorporator: John P. Palmer 4626 Bedford Detroit, MI 48824 Signed by John P. Palmer The last page repeats the Bedford address for where to return the document. It also gives a phone number but I won't publicize it (for now). Other history: Code 82: Annual report, report returned; text letter 7/21/94 5/15/94 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Finally, some misc. info: Phone Disc shows the following: Cathryn M. Palmer on Todd Mark Lane in Clinton Township John Palmer (separate listing) with the same address and number Johnnie P. Palmer on Marshall Street in Southfield, MI The Macomb Co. Business Directory shows the following for the Todd Mark Lane address: C.M. Palmer, first listed in 1986, address is part of Schultz Homes Condos. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Well, that's it! It was kind of a cheap thrill playing private detective; I just hope the consequences aren't too great. Note to JPP: I have not revealed any personal phone numbers or detailed mailing addresses, so unless people go to the trouble of calling information, they can't bother you. Again, all of this info (and the actual addresses and numbers) is publicly available, so I can't see that I have broken any laws or even ethics by revealing this info in an attempt to get at the truth. Revision history: 1/ 2/94 Original version 8/ 5/94 Added annual report info for Detroit Direct Marketing, updated Rabbitnet entry, and added Mustard Seed Inc. entry. RDB